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  #1  
Old 01-20-2007, 01:13 PM
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Default Refractometers

Looking for advice on something suitable for checking Band saw coolant. Whats a good one or is cheapest going to work?

Enco has these:
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INLMK32?PARTPG=INSRAR2

J&L has these:
http://www.jlindustrial.com/endeca/s...Keyword+Search
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Old 01-20-2007, 01:44 PM
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Default refractometers

I have used them a lot over the years to check a lot of soluable oil tanks.Main thing to remember is synthetics with amines usually read 1/2 of true value.I don't ever remember finding a HF/china version of the things.How about homebrewer guys do you have a more resonable cost one ?
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Old 01-20-2007, 02:48 PM
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http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...&PARTPG=INLMK3

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?P...&PARTPG=INLMK3

Ray, your Enco link did not work for me; above are links to the two units that Enco supplies. They are Chinese and are delicate. I have many customers who purchase them and they end up taped and glued back together with dubious accuracy at best after repairs. Undamaged they are accurate enough.

The Enco are servicable, just take care of them.

Refractometers are like micrometers treat them as such.

If you are running a soluble oil get one that has a range of 0-32° Brix.

If you are running synthetics a 0-10° Brix unit will do you fine.

BTW, 1° Brix is equal to 1% solution of sucrose by weight; or 1 gram of sucrose diluted in water to make 100ml of solution. The food industry invented the device.

The ones that J&L is marketing I do not have experience with.

I use Atago Refractomers, they run $200-300 depending on the model. They are made in Japan and are excellent units. The American Optical/Riechert-Jung units are tanks and very durable but difficult to adjust to zero if they get off.
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Last edited by Shade Tree Welder; 01-20-2007 at 06:42 PM.
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:06 PM
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Default Use of a refractomer.

Note: Not all Refractometers are water proof. So do not submerge them.

First of make sure you refractometer is properly zeroed. Clean the prism and cover plate with Windex or soapy water. Wipe it clean with clear water. Place enough water on the prism to get a clear reading the line should read zero on the scale. If it does not turn the adjusting screw until it does.

Wipe the prism off. Place a sample of coolant on the prism. Read the line. Note the reading.

Refractometer Reading x Factor = Concentration by volume.

Every coolant has a unique factor, do not assume you know it. Factors can be obtained from the manufacture, they are often listed on Product Data Sheets and on websites.

When taking the coolant sample to be tested do not skim it off the top of the tank. I contaminants and oils are present they will give an erroneous reading, if any reading at all. Take the sample from the coolant nozzle that supplies coolant to you cutting tool. That way you are measuring what your tooling is seeing and not the floating crap on top of your tank.

Clean your refractometer and put it away.

Most coolants are designed to be run between 5-20%; a few specialized grinding coolants are made to be run lower around 3%, such as carbide grinding fluids and blanchard grinding fluids. These specialized grinding coolants will not provide the lubrication needed for milling, turning, or sawing so do not use them as such.
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Old 01-20-2007, 03:25 PM
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Default When you can't find you Factor, how to determine it.

If you do not know your factor you can determine it.

What you need:

1) Refractometer, make sure you zero it.
2) An accurate volumetric measuring device, 100 ml are excellent for this.
3) An ounce or two of coolant concentrate.

Now I will digress a little, but it is important. Whenever you are mixing coolant and water, ALWAYS!!! Add the coolant concentrate into the water!!! So if you are mixing up coolant in a five gallon bucket fill the bucket with a majority of the water you need and then add coolant concentrate, while mixing/stirring the water. Paint sticks work well here. Then top off with the remaining water to the volume you need.


Now, what you need to do is make a 10% by volume solution of coolant.

10% equals 9 parts water and 1 part coolant concentrate. So if you have let's say, a shot glass. Put 9 parts water into a glass or small container, then add one shot of coolant concentrate. Stir or even shake will.

Allow to settle so any bubbles break, take a sample of your solution and place it on the refractometer, making sure there are no bubbles.

Now if we take our earlier equation;

Refractometer Reading x Factor = Concentration by volume.

we can rearrange it to:

............... Concentration by volume
Factor = ----------------------------.
.................. Refractometer Reading

So you know the concentration is 10% and let's say your reading is 8.0° Brix.

Factor = (10.0/8.0)
......... = 1.25
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Last edited by cutter; 01-20-2007 at 05:12 PM.
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Old 01-20-2007, 04:58 PM
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Very good and easy to follow Ron .We used collaesers (sic ) then the plant went to a central tank system with paper skimmers.We used some synthetic lubes as low as 2-3% but the rust preventures were not up to the task at that ratio even though the point of use was sufficent.The neatest thing we tried was a spray on timer setup .With 10% sprayed for .9 sec on 1 operation would provide galling control through 2 other stages but heat build up was excessive.
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Old 01-20-2007, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shade Tree Welder
Now I will digress a little, but it is important. Whenever you are mixing coolant and water, ALWAYS!!! Add the coolant concentrate into the water!!! So if you are mixing up coolant in a five gallon bucket fill the bucket with a majority of the water you need and then add coolant concentrate, while mixing/stirring the water. Paint sticks work well here. Then top off with the remaining water to the volume you need.
I forgot the pneumonic device.

O.I.L.

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In
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Old 01-20-2007, 11:48 PM
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Whoa, great info thanks.
Is this the right one? The coolant (band-ade) says 10:1 ratio will have a refractometer reading 3.5

http://www.misco.com/products/10440VP.html
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Old 01-21-2007, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-ray
Whoa, great info thanks.
Is this the right one? The coolant (band-ade) says 10:1 ratio will have a refractometer reading 3.5
I think they mean a 9:1 ratio or 10% will give you a 3.5° Brix reading. A 10:1 ratio is 9.1%.

Quote:
Originally Posted by X-ray
Quote:
Originally Posted by your link
Industrial Fluid Refractometer
Old Price $260 - New Price $149 - You Save $111

The MISCO 10440VP Industrial Fluid Tester is a refractometer designed to provide a rapid, accurate method for determining the ratio and concentration of water-soluble cutting fluids and other industrial lubricants. They are designed to assist machine operators in maintaining the delicate water/coolant balance. Proper coolant mixtures reduce waste and tool wear while increasing feed and speed rates, improving the efficiency of your equipment.

The 10440VP is suitable for use in testing metalworking coolants/lubricants, heat-treating fluids, hydraulic fluids, fire-fighting foam and plating baths.

The MISCO 10440VP refractometer is equipped with an arbitrary scale from 0 to 30 units. Do not confuse this scale with the Brix scale. In use, you will need to create a calibration table or graph for comparing 10440VP scale readings to actual known concentrations or properties of your fluid. It is quite easy to prepare such a graph, and the process is completely explained in the instrument instruction manual.

These handheld refractometers have superior optics for a brighter, sharper image than any other refractometer. Razor sharp shadowlines improve the precision and accuracy with which readings can be taken. A light-weight Xenoy polymer body increases impact resistance when the refractometer is subjected to harsh working environments. The sealed, waterproof construction keeps the optics clean and free of condensation. MISCO’s automatic temperature compensation eliminates the need for measuring temperatures and applying a correction factor when taking readings. No other refractometer on the market can offer all these features.
First, that discription in red should send up all kinds of red flags. And you 3.5 on the Band-aid sheet would be meaningless.

Second, I have seen these in operation they are complete POS. I would spend $0.25 on one of them. You would be much better off with the Enco models.
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  #10  
Old 01-21-2007, 10:14 AM
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Ok can someone explain to me what the use of one of these is for?
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