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Old 08-31-2019, 06:08 PM
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allessence allessence is offline
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Default DoAll DBW-8 Bandsaw blade welder whoas

Well, I went out the other day to make the new anvil stand for the Refflinghaus anvil and I turned the power on the bandsaw and heard a strange noise by the welder.

I listened and it sounded like gear noise. I then went to weld a new blade with no luck.

I then opened it up and the gear drive motor is just spinning away with no power going to it.

It uses power from the anneal switch to power the unit. But when I detach the wire connected to the power distribution it continues to run.

Power to the anneal switch is constantly on. But what would power the motor or what would keep the motor just spinning around?

there is no switch per se. When the power trips after a weld the motor used to stop. It also started once the weld button was pushed. To jog it I could just push the weld button to bring it back into position.



What would keep it running? A short internally? I tested the outside to the chassis and no voltage. I checked the wire that connects to the power distribution and it was 0volts.

the yellow wire is the connection to the motor. I think it might have been replaced previously years and years ago as the tape on the motor itself looks like original.
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Jennifer

If I defend myself I am attacked.

My meaningless thoughts are showing me a meaningless world.

My attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability.

I'd like to think of something smart, but I don't want to hurt myself.

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Another Johnson model J Project
Lathe? Maybe..... 1958 SBL 13"
Yeti Esseti Aka running welder on 3phase.
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  #2  
Old 08-31-2019, 06:18 PM
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digger doug digger doug is offline
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Jenn,
I can't understand the diagram, but does that motor run a cam, that shoves
the one jaw towards the other, during welding ?

I thought DoAlls all ran a simple spring loaded jaw set-up.

If this motor runs the cam, it could be a Stryco welder.

It will spin until it gets satisfied, the jaw dropping into the spot on the cam, and hitting a limit switch.
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  #3  
Old 08-31-2019, 06:28 PM
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allessence allessence is offline
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It does have a cam, but no limit switch.

I belive it uses a power in, power in type of deal when the unit is not in welding mode.

Power to both sides vs just 1.

I could be wrong and the reason I came to you guys.
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Jennifer

If I defend myself I am attacked.

My meaningless thoughts are showing me a meaningless world.

My attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability.

I'd like to think of something smart, but I don't want to hurt myself.

My google+ page

DoALL 36"
Another Johnson model J Project
Lathe? Maybe..... 1958 SBL 13"
Yeti Esseti Aka running welder on 3phase.
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  #4  
Old 08-31-2019, 06:44 PM
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It's been about 25 years, I own 2 strycos.

They use a similar open frame motor, that runs by a tap from the welding xformer.

So energizing either anneal, or weld, causes the cam motor to spin (or want to)

Somehow, when annealing, the motor does not turn.

On the stryco IIRC there are (3) anneal taps (lo, mid, hi) and a separate
weld tap (how you feed the primary side of the xformer)

IIRC you must "re-time" the cam, and set it in the "drop" for anneal.

When in the drop, the motor doesn't spin.

When ready to weld, you pull the jaw back, and it cocks the cam/roller thingy.
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Old 08-31-2019, 07:04 PM
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allessence allessence is offline
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there is no way to disengage the anneal function button whether in the cam drop or not. The anneal is aways active.

there is a way to lock the anneal button in for use with the etching tool.

But, it worked perfectly the last time I used it which was about 6 months ago.


I do understand what you mean by the anneal button when in the cam is deenerigized.

There were no missing or broken parts I could see or run trace on.

Now with the information you supplied I will take a closer look, but I spent about 3 hrs just looking and seeing and such. I took off the front plate, pulled the motor assembly, cleaned and lubed the gears.

I did not see an arm to disengage the contact from the anneal button. It does have a lockup so once the weld button is pushed it's a go, until the cam is activated.

the motor spinning around does activate the roller for the cam but all it does is click as there is a linkage but is not connected directly to the anneal function so just spins right on by.
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Jennifer

If I defend myself I am attacked.

My meaningless thoughts are showing me a meaningless world.

My attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability.

I'd like to think of something smart, but I don't want to hurt myself.

My google+ page

DoALL 36"
Another Johnson model J Project
Lathe? Maybe..... 1958 SBL 13"
Yeti Esseti Aka running welder on 3phase.
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  #6  
Old 08-31-2019, 07:37 PM
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I definitely have nothing helpful to add to this troubleshooting discussion but I've been meaning to mention to you that I've been wearing my DoALL cap ever since you sent it to me 2 years ago during the older sister to the present circumstance. This seems like a good time to say that it is, in fact, present with me in this room.
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  #7  
Old 09-01-2019, 09:14 AM
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If you are saying your switch is a big contactor then the leg of the contactor has welded itself in the operating position.

It should be normally open. If you have a continuity meter check through the circuit gwiz traced out and find where you have continuity you are not supposed to have.

Scott

Pictures look way different on the computer than on phone. In your picture of the terminal block there is a screw missing on the terminal block. How long has that been gone? It may have held a piece of something to trip a cam or some other thing. Or it may be nothing. It is a shiny spot that looks out of place.

Do all the controls feel the same? on the diagram where the part are shown there is mention of a reset spring. In the picture as shown on my screen the drawing is upside down, the spring is in the upper left hand corner. Is the spring is used to reset the starting action then it would behave as you are seeing, the motor just runs and does not disengage to be ready for the next weld. The spring may not be much bigger than one in an ink pen.

This to me looks like a 3 wire start stop with an automated stop function.


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Last edited by Scotts; 09-01-2019 at 10:08 AM.
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  #8  
Old 09-01-2019, 03:43 PM
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digger doug digger doug is offline
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This run on 220 ac single phase ?

Did you lose the ground ?

On the pole usually.
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  #9  
Old 09-01-2019, 05:50 PM
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allessence allessence is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotts View Post
If you are saying your switch is a big contactor then the leg of the contactor has welded itself in the operating position.

It should be normally open. If you have a continuity meter check through the circuit gwiz traced out and find where you have continuity you are not supposed to have.

Scott


Sent from my iPhone using ShopFloorTalk mobile app
all ready have. There is no continuity or current.

No it is not welded into the closed position.


My english has gotten really bad over the years. Even worse then it used to be.
__________________
_________________
Jennifer

If I defend myself I am attacked.

My meaningless thoughts are showing me a meaningless world.

My attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability.

I'd like to think of something smart, but I don't want to hurt myself.

My google+ page

DoALL 36"
Another Johnson model J Project
Lathe? Maybe..... 1958 SBL 13"
Yeti Esseti Aka running welder on 3phase.
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  #10  
Old 09-01-2019, 11:29 PM
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Scotts Scotts is offline
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Default DoAll DBW-8 Bandsaw blade welder whoas

Hey I found your videos about the blade welder.

You have a pleasant voice. I must admit the first time I watched your videos.

On the one video you have a piece of blade in the welder and it swung out you hit the button and welded the blade.

I see some gears there and you mentioned above you cleaned and lubed them.

If you took a piece of blade and swung the welder out are any of the gears slipping on their shafts that should not be?

I have never used a blade welder so I went looking and trying to find the process.

More questions but something kept it from just running along all the time before did it not?

If I understood correctly you were able to jog the unit into correct position by pressing the weld button now you cannot do that.

Do you have a short piece of blade to repeat or attempt to weld a blade while the welder is swung out to see what is going on?

Scott


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This post is a bit of a mess. I’ll quit using my phone for stuff like this.
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