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  #11  
Old 04-01-2019, 09:45 PM
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I'm going to re-invigorate this thread, because I just had another bottle of Argon contaminated by water (I suspect). Same old story... this gas worked just fine, until bottle hit 500 psi. Then, my aluminum beads started to go to crap. After checking all of the hose connections, and even testing after making a dessicator (Jody at WT&T), which made no difference, I decided it was time to exchange for a new fill. Sure enough, after hooking up the new bottle the beads are back to bright and shiny. But, the bottle had only 1,900 psi.

So, I'm wondering, if 1,900 psi is common for a newly filled bottle of the "S" size, which is supposed to be 154 cu ft, or am I getting ripped on both ends of gas pressure?
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  #12  
Old 04-02-2019, 12:59 AM
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Thanks for reviving this thread because I had forgotten the specific details about my "water" tank(s). I haven't noticed any issues lately but it is hard to check a larger tank for water short of tipping it upside down and opening the valve (compressed gases only).
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  #13  
Old 04-02-2019, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Gadgeteer View Post
So, I'm wondering, if 1,900 psi is common for a newly filled bottle of the "S" size, which is supposed to be 154 cu ft, or am I getting ripped on both ends of gas pressure?
I used to be in the habit of tossing a gauge on "new" bottles from the LWS. Haven't had the time or diligence to do it lately. I usually mentally note at least 2500psi on a cylinder the first time I hook up a gauge. Haven't had any "shorts" lately. My LWS guys know me and know that I'm not out to screw them and I believe they WOULD believe me if there was ever a concern.
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  #14  
Old 04-02-2019, 08:26 AM
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I worked for Airco for 10 years (30 years ago) and while i never filled a cylinder i did go into the filling room quite often.
I also watched them hydro a few cylinders because i was curious.
The store i worked in did not fill the cylinders with water to test them,they had a "well" in the floor and an elevator that they lowered the cylinder into.
The well was a pressure chamber and after the cylinder was in they sealed the top and filled the chamber with water.
The cylinder already had a pipe installed in the top and they pumped the cylinder full of nitrogen.
The water in the chamber would be displaced if the cylinder expanded.
There was pressure gauges on the chamber and the cylinder of course.

So,no water was ever in the test cylinder (at least at this filing station).

The water behind the neck ring could not get inside the cylinder,the neck ring has the threads for the can and the name of the company around the ring.
Those neck rings are change able,they simply slide down over the neck of the cylinder and they peen the neck down to hold the ring in place.
We had a lathe that was used to bore out the neck rings when needed.
They peened them over with a hammer.
They also have a lathe they would cut the paint off the outside of a cylinder,when the paint got too thick they laided the cylinder down in this "lathe",2 rollers really and the rollers would turn the cylinder and an acme screw running along the side had a bit on it and it would cut the paint off.

Paint scraping and painting was done everyday,those guys had a paint roller with a big spring in the middle of the roller and they could paint a cylinder in 3 swipes,up,down and up,all done.
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  #15  
Old 04-02-2019, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadgeteer View Post
I'm going to re-invigorate this thread, because I just had another bottle of Argon contaminated by water (I suspect). Same old story... this gas worked just fine, until bottle hit 500 psi. Then, my aluminum beads started to go to crap. After checking all of the hose connections, and even testing after making a dessicator (Jody at WT&T), which made no difference, I decided it was time to exchange for a new fill. Sure enough, after hooking up the new bottle the beads are back to bright and shiny. But, the bottle had only 1,900 psi.

So, I'm wondering, if 1,900 psi is common for a newly filled bottle of the "S" size, which is supposed to be 154 cu ft, or am I getting ripped on both ends of gas pressure?
I have 2 bottles 150's, that are half full... and show 1,400 psi. could it be your flowmeter being somewhat damaged/altered readings? due to water coming through it causing it to read the pressure wrong just a thought though.
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  #16  
Old 04-03-2019, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randydupree View Post
I worked for Airco for 10 years (30 years ago) and while i never filled a cylinder i did go into the filling room quite often.
I also watched them hydro a few cylinders because i was curious.
The store i worked in did not fill the cylinders with water to test them,they had a "well" in the floor and an elevator that they lowered the cylinder into.
The well was a pressure chamber and after the cylinder was in they sealed the top and filled the chamber with water.
The cylinder already had a pipe installed in the top and they pumped the cylinder full of nitrogen.
The water in the chamber would be displaced if the cylinder expanded.
There was pressure gauges on the chamber and the cylinder of course.

So,no water was ever in the test cylinder (at least at this filing station).

The water behind the neck ring could not get inside the cylinder,the neck ring has the threads for the can and the name of the company around the ring.
Those neck rings are change able,they simply slide down over the neck of the cylinder and they peen the neck down to hold the ring in place.
We had a lathe that was used to bore out the neck rings when needed.
They peened them over with a hammer.
They also have a lathe they would cut the paint off the outside of a cylinder,when the paint got too thick they laided the cylinder down in this "lathe",2 rollers really and the rollers would turn the cylinder and an acme screw running along the side had a bit on it and it would cut the paint off.

Paint scraping and painting was done everyday,those guys had a paint roller with a big spring in the middle of the roller and they could paint a cylinder in 3 swipes,up,down and up,all done.
Thanks Randy, that's interesting info.


Dave
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  #17  
Old 04-03-2019, 07:30 AM
JBFab JBFab is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccutter View Post

PS: he did mention he marked the cylinder as "wet" inside. Apparently, they are supposed to draw a vacuum on them to purge them before they fill and that one somehow was missed.
I know, I know, this is an old part of the thread, but I thought I would mention - it is true they draw a vacuum on them. If they didn't you would have some real shit gas (although you can get away without a purge if the nice guy returning the cylinder leaves a little pressure in it). The problem is drawing a vacuum doesn't get any water out of the tank.
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  #18  
Old 04-03-2019, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBFab View Post
I know, I know, this is an old part of the thread, but I thought I would mention - it is true they draw a vacuum on them. If they didn't you would have some real shit gas (although you can get away without a purge if the nice guy returning the cylinder leaves a little pressure in it). The problem is drawing a vacuum doesn't get any water out of the tank.


I was thinking the same about the water being pulled out in a vacuum. It would work great if they inverted the tanks though while under a vacuum.


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  #19  
Old 04-03-2019, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBFab View Post
The problem is drawing a vacuum doesn't get any water out of the tank.
IF it is done right it should, water will boil off in a deep Vacuum.
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Last edited by GWIZ; 04-03-2019 at 11:01 AM.
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  #20  
Old 04-03-2019, 08:46 PM
Steeveedee Steeveedee is offline
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The water would boil off, but the vapor would probably contaminate the oil in the vacuum pump, depending on the style of pump.

I'm thinking the help is lazy and/or don't know or care about the cleanliness of the gas, as far as leaving water in a bottle. I have a small oxyacetylene rig. I hope the gases aren't contaminated
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