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  #11  
Old 11-21-2010, 01:58 AM
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My biggest concern with the double wall is that it could potentially become a bomb. I understand the need to contain the home made refactory as it won't work like the stuff we have available but the outside shell needs to be vented pretty well anyhow. You have to account for any moisture in the insulation turning into steam pockets, as well as the fact that the insulation itself will have an unknown amount of expansion as it heats.
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  #12  
Old 11-21-2010, 05:24 AM
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You didnt say where your friend is located, but I have had occasion to futz with a dense volcanic rock. Takes a high temp, holds it well and doesnt fracture or blow apart when you dont expect it.

Even gravel might work OK as a crude insulation. Hell it only has to trap enough heat to get the temp up to useable in a timely fashion...right?
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  #13  
Old 11-21-2010, 09:08 AM
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Water trapped in the linings/coating is your buddy's worst enemy here. There are numerous means to make forges, but all have to be kept dry or there will be issues with spalling and potentially explosion. The simplest is a clay sand mix to make a crude refractory mix. Depending on where he is, he may have access to clay and some silica sand. Sand derived from organic material (sedimentary rock) should be used with caution as they act like sponges and tend to crumble after baking.

In the international arena, I'd look for potters or brick makers. They usually have the best sources of clay. Pottery and bricks are often fired in kilns which need refractory linings.

If there is any oil and gas activity, there should be some clay available as "gel", which is bentonitic clay, unless they're using salt water base fluids, which uses another, clay.

If he insists on making a double sleeve affair, air that doesn't move is a surprisingly good insulator. A pipe suspended inside another with widely spaced standoff spacers would be fairly efficient, and very simple to build
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:30 AM
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If your friend is in the right part of the world have him use igneous rock (volcanic) mortared up with clay. The stuff has already been through a volcano,a little bit of charcoal or propane won't bother it.
Check out the old charcoal kilns in the western USA.
Some are made from granite but it has too hard to carve,granodiorite is softer to cut to shape.
Central Nevada has some still standing,fifty feet across and thirty feet tall, still intact after a hundred years and countless burns.
They would keep smearing clay on the seams as it cooked out.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
My biggest concern with the double wall is that it could potentially become a bomb.
He did say that it would not be sealed totally, but not quite open ended. I would imagine that the back and fronts will be more shored up with clay/dirt mix and opened as needed for the work at hand.

I think he's doing this more as a way to keep a cleaner environment inside the heat area for a particular need, which I have no idea as to what that is, otherwise he'd just continue to use what he's been using for years, again of which I have no idea.

Knowing exactly where he is, is of know concern to me(I'd really rather not know ) , he's employed by Tri'-Can' and hopefully he'll live long enough to return stateside to enjoy some semblance of normal retirement.
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Last edited by LW Hiway; 11-21-2010 at 09:40 AM.
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  #16  
Old 11-22-2010, 10:43 AM
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I've made refractory from furnace cement and perlite.
Make a good slurry and ram it gently into the space.
After firing for a good hour you could still place your hand on the outside of the forge.
Ken
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  #17  
Old 11-22-2010, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LW Hiway View Post
He did say that it would not be sealed totally, but not quite open ended. I would imagine that the back and fronts will be more shored up with clay/dirt mix and opened as needed for the work at hand.

I think he's doing this more as a way to keep a cleaner environment inside the heat area for a particular need, which I have no idea as to what that is, otherwise he'd just continue to use what he's been using for years, again of which I have no idea.

Knowing exactly where he is, is of know concern to me(I'd really rather not know ) , he's employed by Tri'-Can' and hopefully he'll live long enough to return stateside to enjoy some semblance of normal retirement.



Why not consult with iforgeiron.. Haven't seen him in quite awhile but his site is still operating.. http://www.iforgeiron.com/index.php?
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  #18  
Old 11-22-2010, 09:08 PM
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when I want to cool a hot part slowly I just bury it in a sack of portland normal cement.
Would it work as a refractory? I do not know but it would be cheap to experiment with . just take a metal 5 gallon pail and a suitable pipe for an inner liner and fill the space in between with the cement powder add heat such as a tiger torch and test.
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  #19  
Old 11-22-2010, 10:47 PM
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LW, I did read the post but thought that you meant somewhere remote like say Yuma Az, not remote like somewhere UPS doesn't go. I see a lot of people struggle with building castable refractory forges and find that it is just so much easier to steer them to Kaowool.
Since it looks like crude materials are it I now understand why you want the inner liner. What I would suggest is to use the 10" pipe as the inner liner, wrap with scrap steel, leaving a 3"ish gap around it, seal off the ends, but leave an opening on the top o either end, then fill with sand. Sounds simple, the sand insulates nicely, should be readily available, and avoids having to deal with a moist muddy type filler.
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  #20  
Old 11-23-2010, 12:43 PM
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How about a forge in a bucket? Go to google books and search, Popular Science, June 1960, page 140. I actually, made one of these back in the 80's to anneal a car spindle for a project I was playing with. It worked quite well. All you need is a bucket, a one quart juice can, a 2 foot length of 3/4"conduit, an old vacuum cleaner, some charcoal and of course, dirt. I still don't know how to link directly to the articles on google books. I tried, really, I tried.

Dave
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