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  #281  
Old 07-27-2021, 10:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samcord View Post
Keep in mind that wide labels need more space on the wire. The Brady printed labels I used 20 years ago were about 1” wide. This could be a problem when your wire has a 90° bend close to the end. I was using them on network patch chords, which have no sharp radius.

The label books are convenient and easy. No batteries to worry about, no heat sensitivity, fit in your pocket, no misprints, no keyboard…
I used the books back in the day . I also still have a little dispenser that has rolls of number tape in it. It's been so long since I used it I don't know if refills are even available. The Dymo tape is 1/2" (my machine will also do 3/4") it does wrap around numbers or flags that join for about the last half inch. I like the flags way easier for old eyes to read.
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  #282  
Old 07-28-2021, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by allessence View Post

I followed the wiring diagram.. But..

I am running 240V... The transformer came with the jumpers set for 240V but then fried the transformer when I tried to wire it like in the schematics that came with the machine for 240V.. Dang it.. No raging fire, just a little smoke and that wonderful electrical swoosh sound..

I was still only getting like 5V on the X1, X2 wires.
> most of the time we pay for our education
You have to go by the diagram on the replacement transformer


I emailed Oster and they sent over the information for the unit they use. It's a 440/220 to 120/24V unit. ABBG X4075PSF1 75VA
should be here in a few days.. In the mean time I will finish up the work..
>you still have to go by the diagram that comes with the new replacement.
now you know its a 75VA



If the system on the RPC is a Delta Y is there a way to even out the legs?

>I don't know much about Delta .... but you are saying "Delta Y" it is one or the other not both what am I missing?
If you are saying the (voltage) legs on your RPC is off then we had threads on changing capacitors on the RPC to fine adjust the legs (lines)



Does having the 1 high leg 240V and the 2 lower legs at 120V make that much of a difference with the transformer?
>I'm missing something are you saying your RPC is Delta and has a high leg?

transformers are generally happy as long as the voltage input and frequency are within reason.
as I mentioned the two primary coils have to be in the proper phase or they will go poof...........
you can not have one coil going plus while the other coil is going minus ... all they are going to do is fight each other like a short...


answers in Blue
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  #283  
Old 07-28-2021, 09:54 AM
bunkclimber bunkclimber is offline
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Jen the colors on L1, L2 and L3 should be black,red and blue in that order for 208V, on 240 you can follow the same color scheme..or for 480V its yellow orange and brown.. just use black for all three and number tapes if you must, make an addendum sheet to go in the control cabinet with notes as to what you did..and be sure to date it with todays date..nuthin' like opening up a cabinet you wired thirty years ago only to realise how your time on earth passes so quickly.Best of luck
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  #284  
Old 07-29-2021, 10:02 PM
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Jen,

GWIZ has the correct approach on the new transformer. If it does not come with a diagram look it up before hooking it up. Magic smoke is expensive. Oster may have changed suppliers suppliers upgraded or no telling. I have run across some transformers for controls that have 1 common power wire and you pick you voltage and put the other wire on your power supply. No jumpers at all.

As far as numbering wires. I have a brady at the shop and use it. However, those numbers in the booklets mentioned above along with clear heat shrink tube and a cordless heat gun are an awesome alternative. Put your numbers on, cover in clear heat shrink and shrink it down. Them numbers don't smudge no matter what you clean up with in that cabinet.

Scott
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  #285  
Old 07-30-2021, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by GWIZ View Post
answers in Blue
thanks.. very good information.. I misspoke.. Dang memory and dyslexia.. So it's delta 3ph that comes out of the RPC.. 1 leg is 240 and the other 2 are 120 if ran to neutral..

Can I just pull a 120V leg from the contactors and run that to the switches?

One of my buddies said no because it would lower the voltage at that leg only.

I thought this was 1 of the advantages of the Delta 3 ph..


"Why 3-Phase Power?
To understand power in data centers, you need to first be able to identify the differences between single-phase and 3-phase power distribution.



Most residential buildings (single-family homes) are wired with single-phase electric power, which uses one AC voltage delivered over two hot wires and one neutral wire. The voltage across the two hot wires measures 240VAC (for devices like an oven or dryer); across any hot-to-neutral voltage measures 120VAC (for everything else).



Most commercial businesses, on the other hand, are wired with 3-phase electric power, which consists of three AC voltages separated from each other by 120 electrical degrees (or one-third of a cycle). These systems deliver power over three hot wires; the voltage across any two hot wires measures 208VAC. The power load is the same at any instant because of the three single-phase circuits that consistently deliver power (look at the waveform below for a visual representation of this idea).



B23-3-phase-AC-waveform-svg

Because of its consistent load, 3-phase power is ideal for motors, eliminating the need for starting capacitors. It also allows for smaller wires (this means less copper, which translates to cheaper installation and fewer materials needed) and lower (safer) voltages for the same power transmission as single-phase power.



Why 3-Phase Wye?
There are two types of circuits used to maintain equal load across the three hot wires in a 3-phase power system: Let’s compare Delta vs. Wye.



The Delta configuration has the three phases connected like a triangle. Delta systems have four wires total: three hot wires and one ground wire.



Wye systems utilize a star configuration, with all three hot wires connected at a single neutral point. One neutral wire and one ground wire make for a total of five wires in 3-phase Wye systems.



When comparing Delta vs. Wye systems, both measure 208VAC between any two hot wires, but 3-phase Wye systems also measure 120VAC between any hot wire and neutral wire. In other words, the Wye system’s neutral wire is what allows two different voltages and powers both 3-phase and single-phase devices in the data center.



Don’t Forget About Delta
Delta systems still have their place, mainly used for any large motors or heaters that don’t need a neutral wire. Delta systems are also used in power transmission because it’s expensive to run a fourth neutral wire all those miles.



That’s why distribution transformers are wired as Delta-Wye. This creates the neutral that allows the transformer to deliver power for single-phase loads.



Delta-wired devices can also be fed from a Wye source by simply omitting the neutral wire. In a data center, for example, a Delta power distribution unit (PDU) can be used when there’s only a need for 208VAC; Wye PDUs are used when there’s a need for 120VAC and 208VAC voltages.



B23-WyevsDelta



3-Phase Wye in the Data Center
Because their power requirements can’t be met with 120VAC, many of today’s large blade servers only accept 208VAC; however, most data centers still need to power 120VAC devices as well. This is why 3-phase Wye power distribution is the best option for today’s growing data centers.


New transformer is in tomorrow I think.. Yes I won't do that again.. I'll follow what it shows on the transformer..

Quote:
Originally Posted by bunkclimber View Post
Jen the colors on L1, L2 and L3 should be black,red and blue in that order for 208V, on 240 you can follow the same color scheme..or for 480V its yellow orange and brown.. just use black for all three and number tapes if you must, make an addendum sheet to go in the control cabinet with notes as to what you did..and be sure to date it with todays date..nuthin' like opening up a cabinet you wired thirty years ago only to realise how your time on earth passes so quickly.Best of luck
Thank you very much.. I'm using a 4 wire SO cord.. black, red, white and green.. This was what I was looking for.. Crazy how certain things slip away so easily.. Just could not remember.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotts View Post
Jen,

GWIZ has the correct approach on the new transformer. If it does not come with a diagram look it up before hooking it up. Magic smoke is expensive. Oster may have changed suppliers suppliers upgraded or no telling. I have run across some transformers for controls that have 1 common power wire and you pick you voltage and put the other wire on your power supply. No jumpers at all.

As far as numbering wires. I have a brady at the shop and use it. However, those numbers in the booklets mentioned above along with clear heat shrink tube and a cordless heat gun are an awesome alternative. Put your numbers on, cover in clear heat shrink and shrink it down. Them numbers don't smudge no matter what you clean up with in that cabinet.

Scott
Thanks Scott, I would like to get a label printer for other things as well.. Been on the list a very long time..

I did check the wiring again and it is wired for 240V though there are no labels on the wires.. I imagine the only way to label the wires in the motor is to take the motor apart and find out what the layout is..

It's interesting for me that certain things make really good sense, but lot of it has to do with supplies on hand..

So, I would still need to buy and wait for all these items.. Labels, and clear shrink tubing vs getting the label maker and waiting the same amount of time..

I have a tendency not to want to go anywhere..
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  #286  
Old 07-30-2021, 07:38 PM
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A few of the finish photos..

I keep saying this, but there are a few things I still got to fix..

After adding all the cutting oil I have a small leak at the oil pump but no way to shut off the oil going to the pump.. LOL.. Dang it..

I'll thread the pipe that is in there and add a ball valve. Should have done that before but was not really looking for more work..

Of course now it means even more work.. but hey.. Right..
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Jennifer

If I defend myself I am attacked.

My meaningless thoughts are showing me a meaningless world.

My attack thoughts are attacking my invulnerability.

I'd like to think of something smart, but I don't want to hurt myself.

My google+ page

DoALL 36"
Another Johnson model J Project
Lathe? Maybe..... 1958 SBL 13"
Yeti Esseti Aka running welder on 3phase.

https://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums...860#post766860
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  #287  
Old 07-30-2021, 08:05 PM
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Whitetrash Whitetrash is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allessence View Post
A few of the finish photos..

I keep saying this, but there are a few things I still got to fix..

After adding all the cutting oil I have a small leak at the oil pump but no way to shut off the oil going to the pump.. LOL.. Dang it..

I'll thread the pipe that is in there and add a ball valve. Should have done that before but was not really looking for more work..

Of course now it means even more work.. but hey.. Right..
When it's done and you consider it "Done Right" in your heart that's the only thing that counts. I know you take great pride in your work. If your happy then it's as close to perfect as it gets
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  #288  
Old 07-30-2021, 09:01 PM
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Whitetrash Whitetrash is offline
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Kudos, to the SFT "Brain Trust" too. I did a lot of on the job training( OTJ )back in the day. I had to go out in the field and diagnose issues with company owned compactors. I would have paid big money to you guys as my "Phone A Friend" I can read electrical schematics fairly well. But, not expert by a long shot. I was reaching in a Honeywell controller box yanking on wires and whatnot trying to find a loose wire. I thought everything in the box was 12 volt DC NOT!!!! Once I looked closer at the schematic I realized damn near every wire was 240 single phase. I've never reached in a box like that again. I used my get out of jail free card.
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  #289  
Old 07-30-2021, 10:06 PM
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That threader is almost looking too nice to use now. Nice job Jennifer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  #290  
Old 07-31-2021, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Whitetrash View Post
Kudos, to the SFT "Brain Trust" too. I did a lot of on the job training( OTJ )back in the day. I had to go out in the field and diagnose issues with company owned compactors. I would have paid big money to you guys as my "Phone A Friend" I can read electrical schematics fairly well. But, not expert by a long shot. I was reaching in a Honeywell controller box yanking on wires and whatnot trying to find a loose wire. I thought everything in the box was 12 volt DC NOT!!!! Once I looked closer at the schematic I realized damn near every wire was 240 single phase. I've never reached in a box like that again. I used my get out of jail free card.
Whitetrash brings up a good point here. Reaching in and getting a surprise is not good.

A non contact voltage detector is handy to have, it may not detect DC so read your instruction with your detector.

Another thing is to pay attention when you use a volt meter. Make sure you understand how it operates. If you are not paying attention and set it to DC and start seeing no volts you can have live AC and think it is off when it is not. That can make for a bad day that may never stop. Read your manual and understand and admit when you do not understand and ask for help. No sense in just winging it anymore.

Scott
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