Converting a fuel oil furnace to burn waste oil? Possible?

[Whitetrash]

I was going to suggest being patient and letting things settle out and pouring off into a secondary tank and basically doing. Wash, Rinse Repeat. I'm waiting to hear how the centrifuge works.

[toprecycler]

Originally Posted by allessence

I know old thread. But, but, but.

This thread came up after a search.

I bought a CLAVE waste oil burner.

Not knowing anything about waste oil burners is/was a huge disadvantage and the learning curve for me was huge.

Feeding the burner with clean oil is the largest hurdle and having a way to clean all the "free oil" is paramount.

When I change any oil , motor hydraulic, transmission, gear, etc, etc I keep water out.

Water BAD...

Keep in mind it's not only the saving of money but a convince.

Set it and forget it. Since it's a dual fuel furnace I can burn wood or coal when in the shop or need extra olgeat output

Because I'm currently using the manluft I keep the garage door open about 4ft and with wood it stays about 65f on wood.

I'm burning about 1/2gallon per hour on 40x60x22 eve.


Tmwithout cleaning the oil it was a super hassle.

Now it goes about 4months before cleaning just the burner electrodes .

Stcks, stones and such are easy to remove.

Anti freeze, water, chlorinated brake cleaners are a different beast. Especially the last.

Everyone will promise clean oil. Clean to them can be 60/40 water.

I finally made the investment in a centrifuge unit from PA bio diesel.

Inquiring minds want to know. Which centrifuge unit did you get?

I am experiencing same issues with dirt and water in oil I get for my waste oil furnace. I’m looking at ideas to separate them.

But I am also wired very frugal ( cheap) I probably will try to end up reverse engineering something from the pictures/ videos that I find, and making something of my own. Why, because I can. That’s why I have invested in the equipment in my home shop. Part of the challenge and satisfaction will be in the build process.

How well does the centrifuge work for waste oil?


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[Scratch]

I recently built a waste oil burner and while I’ve only been burning with it a month or so, I’ve found it super easy to clean the oil and use. I have a 20 gallon bucket in the unheated loft above my heated shop in my pole barn. I cut an 8”hole in the bucket top, and set a powdered sugar screen bowl in there then just dump in the old oil. I set another uncut bucket top on top of that when I’m not adding oil to keep dust and debris out. Seems to be working great so far.

As far as water, I pour all my one gallon containers that people give me into five gallon buckets and let them sit. The water settles to the bottom and freezes. I pour the top unfrozen oil into my 20 gallon bucket and the ice stays in the bucket. I do still get some water occasionally into my stove but I can see it through the drip feed and hear it sizzling so I just open up the feed and let it dump into the stove until it’s gone. Takes about 10 seconds.

The biggest problem I have is sometimes debris must get past my screen and clogs the drip tube. It’s set at eye level so I just take a peek every time I walk past it in the shop, but If I see no flow, I just open it up and let the clog push through then turn it down again. Probably happens once every 6 hours or so.

So far I’m liking burning waste oil and have had no problem getting it for free.

[mccutter]

I'm not a burner but one of my peeves is some lazy fuck who drains his oil and just leaves it in the pan or pours it into a 5gal bucket, both uncovered. You'all would LOVE my waste oil...

[greywynd]

Look up oil settling, the biodiesel folks use it. Sort of like top’s method, but having 2-3 containers in series, with each being a settling spot. I’ll see if I can find or sketch something up later.


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[arizonian]

What do you do with emulsified oil where the water and oil are so thoroughly mixed it becomes a chocolate syrup? Will the water eventually settle or freeze?

I have no plans on using a waste oil burner but I do remember in my younger days not being care full enough with waste oil as mccutter has alluded to. Yep, I was that guy.

[Shade Tree Welder]

Originally Posted by arizonian

What do you do with emulsified oil where the water and oil are so thoroughly mixed it becomes a chocolate syrup? Will the water eventually settle or freeze?

I have no plans on using a waste oil burner but I do remember in my younger days not being care full enough with waste oil as mccutter has alluded to. Yep, I was that guy.

That is known as a mechanical emulsion. Think a homogenizer used with milk.

To see if you can break the emulsion, using items average person can do and still get a usable product. Get a glass jar, like a pint sized mason jar or any empty food jar from the kitchen.

1. Start with 4 ozs. of the emulsified oil and 4 ozs. of diesel fuel.
2. This will fill the pint jar about 1/2 way shake hard and see if you get a split.
3. What you will most likely get is a dirty looking water layer on the bottom, a rag layer in the middle and an oil and diesel mix on top.
4. If this works, repeat using less and less diesel every time, until you do not get a split.
5. Back up and treat rate and use your larger oil container and let split, the longer you can wait the better.

Freezing generally will not split a emulsion effectively.

There are other chemicals that can be added like calcium chloride, but you are just adding cost to what should be a free fuel.

[allessence]

Originally Posted by Whitetrash

I was going to suggest being patient and letting things settle out and pouring off into a secondary tank and basically doing. Wash, Rinse Repeat. I'm waiting to hear how the centrifuge works.

This is the method most people will use and I used this for a few years..

it's messy, It takes a long time and the amount of space used is impressive.


The centrifuge changed it all.. I can use any oil at any time, even oil with water in it. depending one how dirty the oil is depends on how fast the oil is pumped into the centrifuge.. for clean oil I do about 20gph..

For dirty oil or oil I'm going to run in my 7.3L I'll run it at 10gph.

It was a game changer..

Originally Posted by toprecycler

Inquiring minds want to know. Which centrifuge unit did you get?

I am experiencing same issues with dirt and water in oil I get for my waste oil furnace. I’m looking at ideas to separate them.

But I am also wired very frugal ( cheap) I probably will try to end up reverse engineering something from the pictures/ videos that I find, and making something of my own. Why, because I can. That’s why I have invested in the equipment in my home shop. Part of the challenge and satisfaction will be in the build process.

How well does the centrifuge work for waste oil?

PA Biodiesel is what I bought with a heater.. The whole package was 1700.00..

They had a sale and I jumped in..

Both the Clave oil burner and the centrifuge could be made easily if someone had the time.

I will more than likely make my own burner at some point.. I'll be making my own furnace as well.. The Glenwood dual fuel furnace has caught my eye.

The Clave oil burner has some decent features but there are a few things that I think could be made better with all used oil burners..

Using a regular nozzle for starters.. But the oil would have to be clean..

The body of the centrifuge could be fabricated and the bowel turned on the lathe.

Originally Posted by Scratch

I recently built a waste oil burner and while I’ve only been burning with it a month or so, I’ve found it super easy to clean the oil and use. I have a 20 gallon bucket in the unheated loft above my heated shop in my pole barn. I cut an 8”hole in the bucket top, and set a powdered sugar screen bowl in there then just dump in the old oil. I set another uncut bucket top on top of that when I’m not adding oil to keep dust and debris out. Seems to be working great so far.

As far as water, I pour all my one gallon containers that people give me into five gallon buckets and let them sit. The water settles to the bottom and freezes. I pour the top unfrozen oil into my 20 gallon bucket and the ice stays in the bucket. I do still get some water occasionally into my stove but I can see it through the drip feed and hear it sizzling so I just open up the feed and let it dump into the stove until it’s gone. Takes about 10 seconds.

The biggest problem I have is sometimes debris must get past my screen and clogs the drip tube. It’s set at eye level so I just take a peek every time I walk past it in the shop, but If I see no flow, I just open it up and let the clog push through then turn it down again. Probably happens once every 6 hours or so.

So far I’m liking burning waste oil and have had no problem getting it for free.

If you using a drip type burner, the burner itself doesn't care.. Water just makes the flames sizzle in the pan once it's hot.

No reason to clean it for the most part..

The commercial type used oil burners are built differently..

Be curious as to what you put together.. They have kits now that anyone can retrofit a Beckett burner into a waste oil burner.

I found them last year..

Originally Posted by mccutter

I'm not a burner but one of my peeves is some lazy fuck who drains his oil and just leaves it in the pan or pours it into a 5gal bucket, both uncovered. You'all would LOVE my waste oil...

yes, me too.. But it seems to be normal.. Wish it wasn't so..

Originally Posted by greywynd

Look up oil settling, the biodiesel folks use it. Sort of like top’s method, but having 2-3 containers in series, with each being a settling spot. I’ll see if I can find or sketch something up later.


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Yes, they do.. At least the really cheap guys.. Settling works but it's so slow.. If your using 30 gallons a month.. Well that's nothing..

Settling won't clean the oil as well as a centrifuge.

I burn about 1/2 gallon for 1hrs.. It's the main heat for the shop. On a single fill of the feeder tank I get about 100hrs of burn time..

I go thru about 1200gallons a year.

problem is I need to install some sort of air mover.. It gets really hot at the ceiling.. Need a way to push it down.. Looking at air cleaners.

Originally Posted by arizonian

What do you do with emulsified oil where the water and oil are so thoroughly mixed it becomes a chocolate syrup? Will the water eventually settle or freeze?

I have no plans on using a waste oil burner but I do remember in my younger days not being care full enough with waste oil as mccutter has alluded to. Yep, I was that guy.

When the oil and water is mixed there is no great way to separate them.

I found that heating the emulsion does help a lot.. But using the centrifuge what ever does not separate I just clean out of the centrifuge and burn it in a pan in the furnace.

It's one of the great things about having a multi fuel furnace. It can burn nearly anything.

Originally Posted by Shade Tree Welder

That is known as a mechanical emulsion. Think a homogenizer used with milk.

To see if you can break the emulsion, using items average person can do and still get a usable product. Get a glass jar, like a pint sized mason jar or any empty food jar from the kitchen.

1. Start with 4 ozs. of the emulsified oil and 4 ozs. of diesel fuel.
2. This will fill the pint jar about 1/2 way shake hard and see if you get a split.
3. What you will most likely get is a dirty looking water layer on the bottom, a rag layer in the middle and an oil and diesel mix on top.
4. If this works, repeat using less and less diesel every time, until you do not get a split.
5. Back up and treat rate and use your larger oil container and let split, the longer you can wait the better.

Freezing generally will not split a emulsion effectively.

There are other chemicals that can be added like calcium chloride, but you are just adding cost to what should be a free fuel.

I've tried the diesel fuel.. It's a very time-consuming process and costly.

I've found it's better to run it thru the centrifuge and whatever it collects to burn it in the furnace..

Great info..

I found that certain oils have an affinity and absorb water in substantial quantities. It is really interesting seeing how the layers take place..

[allessence]

Here is a metering pump for an Energy logic.. it's setup for a constant pressure.. I have an adjustable speed motor to attach to it when needed to make the pump adjustable..

My current Clave burner came with a metering pump so that's what I use..

The webster pump is a Waste oil pump.. A big one.. So will keep it for back up pump use when needed.. I bought a lot of items for back up when I found them for reasonable money.


These are some of the photos of the oil feeder tank.. It has the metering pump that feeds the burner mounted on it.

It also has several filters.. There is a filter inside the tank, the filter and water separator on the side and then another filter inside the pump unit itself.

The metering pump feeds oil to the burner and controls how large the flame is.

A person can buy different sized nozzles and adjust the metering pump, air flow from the ports on the burner and then the amount of air supplied to the siphon nozzle..

The oil pressure is about 1/2Psi, the nozzle size is .5gph, the air pressure is 9psi.

Because I run oil and air at lower pressures without cleaning the oil the nozzles will clog..

So clean oil with these settings are a must.. I'd rather get a longer burner time vs more heat.. Btus are Btus but pushing the heat out the stack doesn't do anyone any good.

If I had an air handler I could cut my burner on time.. The air at the floor is about 55, head height is 65 and 8ft up is 75F..

Getting something to force the hot air down would do wonders.

[allessence]

The amount of crud in the centrifuge is from about 225 gallons of oil..

In all, the centrifuge has removed about 2 gallons of water from the 225 gallons of clean used oil.. Yes it was clean used oil.. But even clean oil has some residual from condensation and such..

Heating the oil to about 200F before it enters the centrifuge helps a lot with evaporation..

I have a 35gallon transfer tank and this oil is sent thru the centrifuge to the feeder tank..

I also have an attachment point at the bottom of the feeder tank to hook the pump up to and run the oil in a centrifuge loop for extra cleaning if I feel it's needed.

The orange in the last photo is antifreeze that was in that clean oil.. And I mean this oil was actually clean.. coming from a decent source.

One batch of clean oil had 35 gallons of anti freeze in it..