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  #41  
Old 06-16-2008, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southonbeach View Post
You mentioned about sealer and saw cutting the joints right after finishing the concrete.
Which do you recomend doing first, sealing or cutting?
What kind of sealer do you use for on a shop floor?
I've heard someone talk about a slab cracking within the first 24hrs, I know all concrete cracks eventually, but is 24hrs or less a normal thing or did someone mess up?
Good question.

Sealing should be done asap and on a clean slab..so, if it must be sealed, spray it right after the trowel machines are taken off of it. The cutting can be done the next day unless specified differently by the engineer. The engineers on commercial stuff can muck up perfectly good schedules by making you cut first then clean and spray. Much more labor intensive like that. Not all slabs need to be cut and not all need to be sealed. Most here do not use any compound. I prefer to use it.

As to what kind, I used a curing compound/hardener on mine. It is a house brand of Sheplers/CMC called Cure n Hard. It is very similar to Symmons Quad Cure which is very good stuff. Sonneborne has one called Sonosil that is very good as well. These are basically sealer hardners that will close up the surface and also harden the top layer for durability. These are not sealers that will stay on the surface. After a month or so, they will break down and come off, but you will not notice it at all. A stay on sealer is a different animal and usually applied after the building is finished, esp if it must be cut.

Cracks.....concrete cracks as it cures. For the most part, these will never be seen, but they are there. Adding too much water will make these cracks worsen and can make them big enough to be seen. Pouring too dry can make it tough to work the concrete and consolidate it to a single mass and can cause cracking. There are a myriad of issues that can cause cracking to be visible and worse than normal. Myself, I prefer to see a few cracks as this is how concrete relieves stress. Makes me wonder what is going on in there when I don't see them.
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  #42  
Old 06-19-2008, 05:56 AM
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Another question.

Cutting/expansion joints.

how big does a slab get before it needs cutting or an expansion joint in it?

ie mine will be 20x13, I'm guessing no need for a joint/cut
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  #43  
Old 06-19-2008, 07:12 AM
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great info Don,thanks for posting it!
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  #44  
Old 06-19-2008, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by JohnBoy View Post
Another question.

Cutting/expansion joints.

how big does a slab get before it needs cutting or an expansion joint in it?

ie mine will be 20x13, I'm guessing no need for a joint/cut
I usually don't start thinking cut joints until 3500-4000sf. The cuts in that case would be about the size of your slabs area. You can do it on smaller ones, but it usually doesn't matter.


No problem, Randy.
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  #45  
Old 06-20-2008, 09:00 AM
southonbeach southonbeach is offline
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Another question that kind of goes with ordering of the concrete…
Fiber reinforcement, what’s the pros or cons of it? I know some people just rave about it and think it’s the greatest, skipping the wire mesh and just relying on it. Others aren’t the biggest fan of it. I don’t really like the idea of no metal reinforcement so much. What’s your take on it?
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  #46  
Old 06-20-2008, 09:20 AM
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Fiber only is a no-no, even though everyone in the world does it. That is not what it was made for..just ask the engineers that designed it. It was made to be an admixture...to work along with the steel to prevent random cracking. It works pretty well in its intended use. Steel fiber works better, but the nylon and synthetic stuff works well enough. I would rather rely on plain old steel by itself...fiber alone isn't up to the job.
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  #47  
Old 06-20-2008, 10:16 AM
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I understand that. We have a neighbor build a slab house a year ago and did not put steel in it just fiber. Looks like a map of the grand cannon now.I have concerns on its 40 year life.
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  #48  
Old 06-20-2008, 11:58 AM
southonbeach southonbeach is offline
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Thanks for all the great info. It's nice to get someones opinion/advice on something that is not trying to bid on and get the job. Though you would be welcome anytime to come and do it.
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  #49  
Old 06-20-2008, 01:36 PM
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we had a driveway poured and they talked us into fibre,no steel.
the cracks are only 1/2'' wide in most spots.
i had a concrete guy tell me that whoever did it didnt do it right.
i asked him how could he have screwed it up? the truck dumps it out and you finish it off,right?
no fibre for me!
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  #50  
Old 06-20-2008, 02:10 PM
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i helped on a CHEAP drive one time ,,they used chain link fence,,4" pour for trucks to drive on,,,,it cracked but stayed together
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