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A1exander
06-15-2011, 05:09 PM
Hi,
as a wood worker, I need to make some small planes from 1/8 x 3/4 O1.
But I really don't know much about working steel.

After the blade blanks have been cut and shaped,

I heard that I can temper them in the oven at 400 deg. for about 20 min. but been told that I have to harden them first.

So my question is ... how do I harden them blanks?

Preferably a quick and dirty way or shall I say an easy way would be nice, considering I have a wood shop not a metal one.

Thank you for your time for helping this old sawdust maker.


A1lexander

milomilo
06-15-2011, 05:19 PM
Welcome aboard. Others here will let you know the how to's on your planes. Let's see the pics of your progress.

A1exander
06-15-2011, 06:25 PM
.
Thank you milomilo

Process eh...ok...

I use an assortment of woods...cocobolo, mahogany, box wood, black african...whatever is hard and in the scrap box.
The planes on the right have old Nicholson files ground into blades.




The ones on the left are the shaped O1 steel that I don't know how to harden.
You can see two of the blades or irons that I'd like to harden and then temper.





these pics are of a Nicholson file being worked and is pretty much the same with the O1 flat stock except that I can cut the new O1 with a hack saw.





Drilled some holes in cocobolo, the blade bed is at 45 deg.





Cleaning up the drill hole tuning it into a tapered square hole.




I then cut a wedge from a piece of boxwood and here she be.


Sorry, I don't have pics of the others planes being made.

and yes I am a luthier and these are violin finger planes for carving the plates (top and backs)

Here is a pic of one of my instruments.


Hope you like this little photo presentation.

Now hoepfully someone will tell me how to harden O1? :) please


thank you
a1exander

GWIZ
06-15-2011, 06:35 PM
I heat the O1 to 1550º and quench it in old Vegetable oil.
I would say just above Cherry Red.

Wear a safety shield and be careful don't catch anything on fire, best to do away from flammables.

A1exander
06-15-2011, 06:50 PM
I heat the O1 to 1550º and quench it in old Vegetable oil.
I would say just above Cherry Red.


Thank you GWIZ, ummm not to sound ignorant or nothin...but how do I do that...I mean like, how do I heat it to 1550...my oven won't go that high. and I don't have torches.


I can fill up a BBQ with charcoal and blow 100psi over or through it, will that get them blanks hot enough?

thankx

GWIZ
06-15-2011, 06:53 PM
Welcome to the site, looks like you do nice work.

As to pictures,
On this site we download them to this site, as we lost too many threads when the off sites clear them out.
Check out FAQ.
Photobucket sucks, Not only that I'm on dial-up and PB takes tooo long tooo load all the pictures at once..

GWIZ
06-15-2011, 07:13 PM
I can fill up a BBQ with charcoal and blow 100psi over or through it, will that get them blanks hot enough?

thankx


You can try it but not at 100psi more like ~10psi, if it does not get hot enough you can get a torch.
It will harden to some point I just cant say how hard.

Here is a link that may give you an idea, as long as your piece is not larger then 2" x 1" x 1/8. you should be able to harden one edge.
Just a note, some of the propane torches don't get all that hot.
http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18216

allessence
06-15-2011, 07:23 PM
Hi and welcome aboard. Nice bowl planes.

Have you made any Japanese ones?

Hardening O1 is an easy task as long as you can get it up to heat.


For the correct temperature you can use a magnet. As soon as it looses magnetism you thrust it into the oil. Be sure and submerge it all the way this will keep it from flaming up.

I actually like dextron or Mercron for oil quenching. It leaves a nice mat finish on the metal vs all the scale or motor oils.


As to temperature. If you are going to be making a lot of these then an A/O torch setup will suit your needs about the best.

Me, myself and I prefer a forge either coal or charcoal in use. But we can't all have everything.

allessence
06-15-2011, 07:26 PM
a charcoal grill with a hair dryer or you could use a shop vac for the blower.


Plumb the blower into the bottom of the BBGrill and start a fire as the fire goes on you can do it with pine or even seasoned hardwood but this gets tricky if you have never done it before.

I'll post up some pictures if you'd like.

A1exander
06-15-2011, 08:01 PM
a charcoal grill with a hair dryer or you could use a shop vac for the blower.


Plumb the blower into the bottom of the BBGrill and start a fire as the fire goes on you can do it with pine or even seasoned hardwood but this gets tricky if you have never done it before.

I'll post up some pictures if you'd like.


So then if me reading you right,

moving air through some hardwood in an old break drum, wheel rim or BBQ will be able to get the steel blanks up to cherry red? Yes?

Thanks for the pic offer but thats just a hassle to upload for you and not really necessary.


Haven't done the pull type Japanese type planes as of yet. They are on my list once I get this hardening and tempering worked out.


thankx

cutter
06-15-2011, 08:11 PM
Aonexander - as GWIZ advised, read the FAQ (http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/faq.php). http://www.shopfloortalk.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

We do not use embedded images or off-site hosting and we especially do not use Photobucket.
The FAQ will tell you why.

CEC
06-15-2011, 08:27 PM
Welcome on board A1ender.
Beautiful work you got going on.
I sometimes wish I had more time and patience to work with wood.
I love those homemade planes you posted pictures of.

A1exander
06-15-2011, 08:34 PM
Welcome on board A1ender.
Beautiful work you got going on.
I sometimes wish I had more time and patience to work with wood.
I love those homemade planes you posted pictures of.

Thank you CEC,

I wish I had the patience to work with metal. :)

You got any other suggestions for a quick and dirty way to harden O1?


A1exander

midmosandblasting
06-16-2011, 02:52 AM
Welcome to the site. Due to Embarq deciding we did not need internet fot the day I am remiss in catching 1st post. Please read below if you have not already found it.Pictures Cutter already covered . Some guy decided to doze out the fiber optic.

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USMCPOP
06-16-2011, 06:27 AM
Here's an article that describes one way of doing it:

http://villagecarpenter.blogspot.com/2008/02/heat-treating-tempering-blade.html

And another:

http://www.threeplanes.net/toolsteel.html

A book I can recommend is The Complete Modern Blacksmith by Alexander Weygers. He was a talented fellow: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Weygers

Pat
06-16-2011, 07:49 AM
Welcome A1exander,

For relatively small strips of steel I have used a simple Mapp torch and a Tempilstik...........see link below.

The sticks appear to be fairly accurate and are real easy to use. Even though the link I attached will let you purchase directly from the maker, some larger welding supply places also carry them. They have 1500F (816C) and up to 2000F. I think I paid about $8.00 for the last one I bought.

http://www.tempil.com/closeup.asp?cid=39&pid=173&theme=2

http://www.tempil.com/admin/files/FAQs/FAQs_Stiks.pdf

tnmike
06-18-2011, 04:54 AM
o1 is easy to heat treat It has a very high carbon content and gets screaming hard out of the quench. (oil) Bring the steel to non magnetic (1550 f) and quench in oil. ATF or vegetable oil will work well. At this point the steel is very hard and brittle. You need to temper it by placing it in an oven for two hours at 475 F.

Its a great steel and its cheap. Enco is a great source for precision flat ground. Its only drawback is its prone to corrosion.

precisionworks
06-18-2011, 08:21 AM
Tons of info on the web, like this:

Hardening
Preheat thoroughly at 1200ºF then heat to 1450ºF to 1500ºF depending on section size. Hold until uniformly heated through. Quench in warm thin quenching oil to about 125ºF and temper immediately.

Temper For One Hour
300ºF -------------------------C 63-64
400ºF -------------------------C 61-62
500ºF -------------------------C 58-60
600ºF -------------------------C 54-56

An infrared thermometer is the easiest way to gage the temp, but not every IRT will read to 1500°F (none of the inexpensive ones that I know of). Color temp is the only way to do this without either an IRT or without a heat treating oven.

A good article here that touches most of the basics: Heat Treatment of Tool Steels. (http://www.threeplanes.net/toolsteel.html)